OLDER LAW STUDENTS
I have attended two different law schools, and at both one can find a fair number of older law students. Older is a relative term, so let me begin by saying that I will soon be 24 years old. When I use the word “older,” I am talking about individuals in their thirties, forties, fifties, etc.
I love older law students. As a general rule, it has been my experience that they work hard, are friendly, and are successful in law school. There are two living examples of this at SIU. These living examples are the Editor in Chief and Managing Editor of the SIU Law Journal. As far as success and hard work goes, the titles of their positions speak plenty. As far as friendly goes, they are easy to talk to, and address any questions or concerns I have quickly and professionaly.
If you are an older person looking for a second career in the legal profession, do not be afraid to return to school. You may think that you will be at a disadvantage since the younger students are straight out of college. You may also think that you will have a hard time fitting in. I assure you that both of those fears are unfounded. If you come, you will do well and be most welcome.
38 Comments:
Thanks! As an older law student (I'll be 50 next semester) I can say that I had both fears you mentioned -- that I was ill-prepared for another round of academia (especially in a competitive law school environment against such bright young people who have been attuned to critical thinking and study skills for most of their lives). Also, I was very keenly aware of the fact that I was more than 2x the average age of a law student and what that might mean to "fitting in".
Both fears have, thus far, proven to be unfounded. I know most of my section, most know me and we all get along famously. Moreover, we help each other out with respect to studying, note-taking, etc. I've felt quite welcomed and am loving law school.
I think it depends on the school. I'm at a Tier 1, and I can assure you that older students are not welcomed, and are practically invisible.
I don't think I'd recommend it to anyone over 30. (I'm 33.)
I think it very much depends on the school. I know the few older students (and I'm one of the older "typical" law students at my school at 28) in my law school (lower 1st tier, if that makes a difference, as the previous commenter posited) are exactly the opposite as you described: abrasive, unfriendly, prone to "hogging" class discussions with inane off-topic blather, and definitely not among the top of the class rankings... This was actually a great disappointment to me. As an undergrad/ master's student, I often took classes with older students and usually found them to be more articulate and thoughtful in their classwork and also more empathetic and open in their relationships with their fellow classmates. I've often wondered why the difference exists and now I'm hearing that maybe it's the school and not the field. That's quite reassuring to me. I hate the idea of anyone being too afraid to go back to school and pursue a dream just because they may not fit the profile of a "typical" law student. I'm glad to know that it's so obviously acceptable and accepted (I mean, EIC of the Law Review! That's phenomenal!) at other schools.
I am someone who has just about always been interested in persuing a law degree, and I am sure I would have already if I thought I could financially do it! I am 42 with a B.A. in Management, but I have a 19 yr. old in college and a 16 year old who will soon go. I am afraid to give up my $21 an hour factory job, but I know I'll never be happy if I don't earn a law degree. Any suggestions?
evreedaynew:
A part-time program might be what you need: you can still keep your job AND go to law school.
Hello everyone:
I am glad I found this website. I have been looking for comments on older law students, because I am so desperate want to pursue this field. I have love the law - but family/job and fear was unable. I'll be 50, BA Pol.Sci. and working full time.
Again thanks for the positive views in older law students.
cheers, serak
Hello;
any suggestions and direction for a 50 yr. old anticipating law school for a career change? 50, full time employment and female.
any comments of support would be greatful to attack these fears.
I've set my sights on becoming an admiralty lawyer for two decades, fully expecting to start law school when I retired from a successful Navy career. After retiring, I was offered and accepted a superb job with outstanding pay. I figured I could start law school once I built up a "war chest", and I also wanted to get a few more maritime credentials such as a commercial (USCG) captain's license and a master's degree in international maritime operations. At age 52, I'm more motivated than ever to start a new career in admiralty law, but I'm also more convinced than ever that my age will work against me regarding getting into law school and getting a job in the admiralty field after school.
Any thoughts?
you should not let age get in your way - because if it's for you the job as an admiralty lawyer will be there for you. Also check Concord law school online.
I am 58 years old and in my second year of law school. My school has been very welcoming. It has both a part-time program and a full complement of evening classes. There are lots of students here who are 40ish or older (though I suspect almost nobody's as old as I am!). I have apprehensions about finding a job at my age but school has been going fine. I would love to hear from anyone who went through law school after age 50 and got a job.
Interesting comments, looking back over a year since the original post (I'm now approaching my 51st birthday and am in my 2nd to last semester of law school). The commenter two after me suggests that which "tier" your school is makes a difference. I don't know what the tiers are, per se, but I know that my school is ranked either 7 or 8 depending who's doing the ranking (I attend the University of Michigan). So, I suspect that puts it in tier 1. In any event, we have several "older" students here (yes, I am the eldest) and all -- to the best of my knowledge -- are respectd and valued. I don't think being older changes who you are. If you're prone to being abrasive and obtrusive at 24, you'll likely be that way at 48.
Good luck to you all!
But which schools are more welcoming of older students and which are not.
TIA
Hello Denise: This is going to knock your socks off. I am 68 years of age and studying for the LSAT. I will take it this June 12th 2006. I hope to start law school in Aug of 2007. I will graduate at the tender age of 73 and immediately hang out my shingle. I intend to be a pit bull litigator and fullfill my life's ambition. I will not let anyone get in my way.
Frank Minton
Commenters two and three just don't get it. Age is not a disabling factor in law school success; ability is! So, as a bright and able 50 year old retiree, I have not only returned to college to complete my undergraduate degree in philosophy, I also plan to attend a Tier 1 law school. The few cognitive advantages twenty somethings have over bright forty and fifty year old students are not overwhelming. Consequently, I encourage all of my older compatriots with ability to go for law school. After all, twenty somethings don't rule the world!
Frank Minton,
Best of luck to you! You go for it!
Like the other "mature" students, I agonize over whether I should take out the loans and devote the time and energy necessary to succeed in law school. While I haven't made a firm decision as yet, I can't let it go, either.
Good luck to all of you! I'll be checking back.
Sherry
I was so glad to find this site, what positive comments about attending law school for older students. I have worked for law firms for the past 22 years and been fearful after two unsuccessful attempts at the LSAT. Ever day I get a younger attorney 22+. I am a 46 year old with no children just a dream. Recently secured a Real Estate license so, I am charged. Any suggestions on takinmg the LSAT and passing high.
chedwick31@yahoo.com
I am 50 years wise and will be taking the LSAT in February 2007. I plan on attending prep courses in December. I live in California and really appreciate and relate to the concerns posted here. However, I figure I can be 55 with a law degree or 55 without one. Being accepted by fellow students would be pleasant and perferable but not a necessity. Non-acceptance would only demonstate their insecurities, not distact me from my goal. Life experiences from us "older" students actually give us an advantage.
I am also very glad I found this site. After years of "should I try or not" issues, I have decided that I really would like to go. A lot can be said, I think for those of us who actually have experienced a good portion of our lives Not that we are any better but I would like to think that we can be more focused, having bypassed anything that could be construed as peer-pressure and fear of competition. I look forward to all of the challenges of the LSAT and law school.
Just turned 40, have 6 classes to finish an MBA and just hit the idea - what if I went on for a law degree?
Neat to come up with something so relevant with my first search on "older law students".
With 15 year of corporate experience & the MBA, its not a problem getting a job...
But law school is an old dream, and I'm pleased to find I'd be in good company if I decide to go for it.
Speaking of, very impressed with all who posted, and closing with a hearty "GO FOR IT" to all with this dream!
SLK
I'm a 57-year-old woman with a Ph.D. in math, 20 years of experience as a software engineer and 4 years of doing part-time freelance journalism. Amid all that I've been a jazz pianist and teacher - my students are playing gigs, teaching other students, etc.
Along the way I almost went to law school - twice I was admitted but didn't go due to finances and working full-time. Aced the LSAT and was recruited by law schools all over the place asking me to apply. (I didn't get into Harvard, though..)
This year I decided it's now or never and I really want to do law. I figured I was too old to go to law school and get a job, so I enrolled in a paralegal program. We have all the classes, but watered down: civil procedure, legal research and writing, torts, contracts, etc., and I am blowing everybody out of the water.
In fact, the faculty has decided I don't belong there and that I should go to law school. One instructor (an attorney) ssid, "You're too smart to be a paralegal." The director refuses to place me as a paralegal after graduation because she says I wouldn't be a good fit.
I'm in a quandry and have almost decided to go to law school, which is where I really want to be. I have no worries about competing with the younger students, but I am very, very worried about trying to get hired at age 60 or 61. (I don't look
it due to decades of yoga, etc. but it will be clear from when I got my B.A.)
What I really want to do is animal rights law, which I know is hard to get into. The bell is tolling and I want to do something good for the world.
Can I hang out a shingle on my own when I get out, maybe doing probate work and tying that in with animal law (trusts for pet owners, etc.) in the beginning? Or would that, as a neighbor who's an attorney told me,amount to malpractice? I'm scared out of my wits by the prospect of being unemployable because of my age. I've heard several horror stories.
Sorry for the long post.
Anonymous: I say go for it. Visit the "My Shingle" blog for information on hanging out your own shingle. Many people have worked for themselves straight out of law school. Between now and graduation, you will have plenty of time to figure out a sound and ethical business plan. Also, FWIW, I believe Illinois has a statute for pet trusts. They are generally invalid in other states, but courts will allow them if the trustees are willing to serve the pet-beneficiaries.
Thank you to everyone who posted comments on older law students. I am 49 yr old and widowed @ 37 with three minor children. After my husbands death, I decided to complete my AS degree rather than rejoin the workforce. I then went on to work full time and attend school 4 nights perweek and also take one online course to complete my BS degree in HR Management. I graduated in 2004 and would like to now continue to study Employment Law. People tell me I must be crazy but I have a dream to go to law school and work on my own as an employment attorney. Your comments have encouraged me to follow my dream and it's so great knowing that others even older than myself are pursuing their dream! I would like to know how one gets started studying for the LSAT exam. All suggestions are welcomed.
Thanks again.
Me too!
For the person who said they want to go into Animal Rights law -- me too! Most especially veterinary malpractice. Why is it hard to get into?
I'm 42, and my pet was a victim of what I believe was malpractice. I spent a lot of time preparing the case for the State Board, and I did get them to file charges against him. During the course of preparing what became a 60-page complaint and two rebuttals, I did a lot of legal research.
I realized that:
a) I have always cared much more about animals than people (at leat in teh abstract) and always will (I didn't "grow out of it" like I thought I would -- I was on all these anti-vivisection mailing lists when I was 7, LOL)
b) My strengths are research, analysis and writing.
c)I love to argue, to find facts and interpret them in a way that supports my point of view
d) I am always seeing what's wrong that needs fixing. I must admit that I am not a person who envisions future paradise, or works toward a positive vision of the future, but rather a person who is more motivated to attack what is bad in the present. I don't necessarily like that or think it's healthy, but it's not changing so I should learn to use it.
The only thing is, I am a well-paid, well-treated manager in the information technology field. I like my salary and don't know if I feel like chewing through all my money going to law school only to get out and make $35K if I'm lucky.
Is that what I'm looking at?
Poverty at 50 doesn't sound fun, and I haven't managed my money as well as I should have.
I am forty-one and in my last year of law school. I have found that law school is no more difficult for an older student than a younger student. Most of the younger students are great.
But here is the rub, and please read this. I wish someone had told me before I started law school! If you don't attend a 1 tier school don't waste your time! I attend a regional 2 tier school, and employers care about your age. Young attorney do not like to hire older associates, and the pay is not going to be anywhere close to what you were making...
Your real world experience will actually work against you. Law firms do not care about anything but legal experience. Your best hope will be at smaller or midsize firms.
However, federal and state jobs tend to care less about your age. Actually, in that situation it may work to your advantage because in jobs like Public Defenders and prosecuters they throw you in the courtroom very quickly and the jury thinks you are very experienced because of your age, but these positions pay in the 30's - 40's. See the problem...big debt and little pay.
However, your age can be overcome if you graduate from a top law school! Even large firms across the nation will hire older employees from these top schools.
My suggestion. If you are older, go to law school only if you get accepted in a 1 tier school, if you plan on starting your own firm after law school (you need money for this), you have enough savings that you can take a lower paying federal or state job.
Don't forget you still need to make good grades even for public jobs, although the place less emphasis on them. However, I am routinely passed over for clerkships and associate positions for students with lower grades because they are younger. It is not a good idea to file suit against employers for wage descrimination if you are trying to get a law job. That would be a death wish for getting an actual job.
I am sorry about the long post, and I don't want anyone to think that I am sour. I just want to give the scoop that I wish I had. Don't believe schools. They are in the business of getting students!
I agree with the post above. The problem is not law school. The problem is going to be what are you going to do after law school
Law school is very competitive. I would not worry very much about if you will be accepted by other students. Who cares? Relationships are important, but you really do not have that much free time, especially during your first year. If that is a concern, just ask the dean at the school that you intend on attending to meet one of the older students and then ask him/her if they like it.
LSAT...Kaplan, although it pretty much is a monopoly.
As far as hanging out a shingle after law school...it is possible. You will need money to keep you going and clients. People are not going to flock to your door just because you hang out a shingle. There is a problem of malpractice. Courts will not cut you slack because you are a novice attorney, and trust me, law school does not prepare you to start your own firm!
Having wanted to be a lawyer ever since I can recall, never having gone for it, and now finding myself 55 and STILL struggling w/ the decision, I really appreciate finding this site, and everyone's comments.
However,, after much research and speaking with attorney friends, I have come to the conclusion that since a top law school is not an option for me, after considering the expense, 3 years lost income, low starting salaries, and the challenges of even being hired at 59yo, I am coming to the conclusion that getting a paralegal certificate might be more realistic. It would get me in the field I'm interested in quickly, without incurring debt.
It seems many paralegals earn bonuses in addition to salaries, and can make a reasonable living.
Long-winded, I know. But I'm wondering if anyone has similar thoughts, or has come to the same conclusion? I'd really appreciate any input. Thanks!
Wow, a post that has lasted two plus years in ongoing comments. It interests me because someone very close to me just turned 45 and deeply regrets having not gone to law school when he considered it around age 40 and 41. I was struck by the number of people who said "I can't let it go." I think this is similar to what he feels. His fear is an inability to get a job after graduating (well that and getting the tuition to begin with). I wish we could hear from some who have travelled this road and come out on the other side and how they have fared.
So some lawyers actually earn less than $40K a year? Wow, that's a scary number in terms of repaying loans.
Seems I'm in a similar situation as others who have posted here. I'm 35, have an MBA and am considering law school attendance beginning the summer of 07'. I'm aiming for a tier 1 (leaning towards U of M), but I too am concerned with taking a step back in salary. I'm employed by a major corporation today and make 75k a year, but my heart seeks a JD. As I'm not interested in part-time attendance, am I crazy for considering taking debt of 150k to chase a law degree?????
Is it worth it? It depends. There are soo many variables as to whether an older student will be able to get a job. I agree with the above posts that it simply much more difficult for an older law graduate to get a job after law school, but is certainly not impossible.
The large law firms, the ones that pay the best (110-150 a year depending on the market) are not really interested in older graduates.
I graduated at 42 and was extremely upset to find that no one was interested in hiring me although I was in the top quarter of my class. I graduated from a 2 tier school and have heard that older students from tier one schools have an easier time.
Faced with zero job prospects, I started my own firm and it is very difficult. I barely get through the month. It is ugly!
My suggestion is if you get into a Top tier school go, but if you don't, don't quit your day job and go part time!
As with everything, A lot depends on who you know. If you know someone that will hire you after you graduate, this could certainly be a factor.
I deeply regret leaving my job to go law school. The amount of work involved, the sacrifice, and the limited pay and job prospects after graduation just are not worth it.
I am 50 with some college credits to my name and am in the process of completing an AS/BS in Paralegal Studies. I also held onto the dream of law school and I still believe that I will get there (I'll have to do something during retirement, won't I?) but, in the meantime, I will be working in the legal profession. The program I am in covers alot of ground, so, I will be prepared for law school when I eventually get there. Perhaps we older paralegals and attorneys should group together and start our own practices. All that combined life experience, desire and bravery could make some kind of synergy. Good luck to all of us and you can bet we will all make it.
I'd like to thank everyone who has posted about their experience, hopes and dreams about going to law school as an older student. My dream is to go to law school and work on wrongful conviction cases. One of my relatives was wrongfully convicted of murder, and I've spent the past couple of years learning about the main causes of wrongful convictions. After reading these posts, I've decided to start by taking paralegal courses and studying for the LSAT. I'm want to go part-time while I continue to work, because if I can avoid accumulating too much debt then I can volunteer on WC cases. In the meantime, I'm writing a series of plays (SEVEN WRONGFUL ACTS) about the causes of wrongful conviction to help educate the public about how things go wrong and what can be done about it. I hope that people will continue to post about their experiences as older students--it's very inspiring!
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Boy, am I glad I found this page. I've always been intrigued by law. But until I was 39, I assumed I wasn't smart or accomplished enough to do it because I had a poor education from 10th grade on at an arts academy. At that time I applied -- thinking I'd never get in -- to a ivy for a liberal arts MA, and got a full scholarship! Unfortunately the degree hasn't led to many decent employment possibilities, and now at 46 I'm certain I want to study law, and also certain I will do well.
But here's why I'm glad I found this page. Because of some unexpected recent events in my life, like the death of a parent, I was contemplating trying to hit the Feb. 1 deadlines and the Feb. 10 LSAT. Now I can see that I should take a deep breath and a year and make sure I do well. Years ago I got a 159 without studying, so I'm hoping I can do well enough.
Another suggestion from a friend was attending a school like ASU in Phoenix and then settling in the area because their law school's the only game in town. What do people think?
I AM A 48 YEAR OLD FEMALE NEW YORKER WHO GRADUATED AT THE TOP OF MY CLASS (BS IN BIO 1990). THINGS WENT HAYWIRE AFTER COLLEGE, SO I AM IN REAL ESTATE. I SHOULD HAVE GONE TO LAW SCHOOL BECAUSE OF MY BELIEFS, CONVICTIONS, SPEAKING ABILITIES, UNDERSTANDING OF THE LAW, ETC. I STATED I AM 48 BUT WOULD DO ANYTHING TO GET A JD AND SPECIALIZE IN AREAS OF INTEREST. ANY SUGGESTIONS ON SCHOOLS FOR THE NON-TRADITIONAL STUDENT WOULD HELP.
Very happy to have found this page... I am a married 37 year old with four kids and I have reached a dead-end in my current career. Last year I decided to go back to school and I applied to and was accepted by University of Houston Law Center(current rank 60) and South Texas College of Law(4th Tier)as a part-time student. Any advice from anyone on which school I should attend? I have heard that South Texas is a better place for working parents but frankly I am concerned about the ranking...
Last year I decided to go back to school and I applied to and was accepted by University of Houston Law Center(current rank 60) and South Texas College of Law(4th Tier)as a part-time student. Any advice from anyone on which school I should attend? I have heard that South Texas is a better place for working parents but frankly I am concerned about the ranking...
This blog is a god send. I'll be turning 40 in October and I'm considering going to law school at Whittier College or Concord Law School which is an online law school. I've done a lot of research on various opportunities for older students.
My interests are really public law mainly criminal and juvenile justice. This is something that I've wanted my whole life but didn't have the maturity to pursue it when I was fresh out of college.
Does anyone have any input on older grad getting into the public defender's office?
Wow, very interesting site. Actually it was a bit of depression why I tap into google and find this site. I currently run a small tax and accounting practice who has always wanted to go to law school as one of my many dreams. I have a MS in accounting with a concentration in taxation and has taken the CPA exam and failed by one point 3 years ago. As a result I become demotivated but many of my clients, family and friends are encouraging me to redo the exam which I will be doing this year. On the other hand a part of me wants to do the one thing that is left on my dream list which to have a law degree but I kept saying I am too old. I made an attempt to do law when I was 40 years old and went against my wishes. Today I am 51 and is still unhappy. I don't worry about being in debt (after all I am a financial person). Living in America is about being in debt. I worry about my happiness. Since I will not be looking for a job, but will be adding it to my credential of being a tax attorney which is my ultimate dream ... being a CPA and a tax attorney.
Can anyone advise me. I live in NYC. Is there a school that will suit me.
The aspiring 68 year old law school student to be, can you please email me. I am eager to hear how is it going.
Mary at exqtax@aol.com
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